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2008 Honda Hornet
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello everyone, posting for my friend since he has no clue about mechanics or how things operate and I am the designated mechanic for simple/easy things that dont need a shop.

The bike in question is a 2007 Ebony ZX6R with 96,000km (60,000mi), all original parts except for cooling hoses that were oil damaged, battery, coils and a muffler.

Code 63 Question:
Last year (2020) in August we replaced the stock muffler with a used stock muffler (replacement was not used beyond one month, used muffler owner replaced the stock muffler quickly after purchasing their bike) that included the cables to the servo. The original muffler eventually had the valve stick closed due to rust and throw a code 63 with MASSIVE power loss. During replacement I opened up the servo motor since it didn't feel "clean" when I was feeling how it rotated when keying on (felt a bit crunchy), come to find out a couple teeth were chipped on the plastic driven (larger) gear (probably due to the rusted valve), drive gear looked OK. I disassembled the servo and flipped the gear over 180 degrees to put some wear on the other unused side and added some new grease.

Today (June 3rd, 2021) he came back from a 4 hour ride with the FI light blinking and code 63 again but no power loss as before. Kawasaki shows that the original part has been superseded with a new part number (old 211740003 ,new 21174-0005) but it costs €264.20 ($322.10). I do not want to replace this with a used servo just to have the same plastic gears break again in a year. Is there a good quality aftermarket servo for this bike? I can only find used parts or elimination kits, we CANNOT use the elimination kit because it could fail the yearly inspection due to modifications, as I understand it any major modification (muffler, tire sizes, color, weight etc) to the bike needs to be measured, approved, and the registration updated and re-issued by the government with the new information.

#3 Coil On Plug Question:
In 4 years this bike has "eaten" 3 coils and they have ALL been for cylinder #3. we replaced the valve cover gasket (also 3rd time) this Feb since it was leaking HORRIBLY and Kawasaki here in Europe refused to do anything about it even though there is a TSB/Recall (MC 08-16) about the problem in the USA. Each time the coil holes had been oily but #3 and #4 were always filled with oil. I was thinking that the oil ingress was killing the coils but why only #3? When #3 failed the first time I had him order a complete coil set and we replaced them all at once, after that we only replaced #3 when it failed. The last failure has happened AFTER the valve cover gasket change and there was no oil on the coil. I did an ohm test of the coil and it matches the others so the primary windings should be OK, I did re-gap the plugs since they were getting a bit close to out of limits. Could there be an issue with the harness? I have not checked the charging system yet. Maybe it is just a fluke and these coils have been defective? That is why I would like your help/input on this.

Thank you very much for reading this far, I know it was long winded but I am getting close to the limit of what I can do with the tools and equipment that I have. There are a couple other issues that I will more than likely also need some help on but I need to make sure that the front tire is not the cause of them first.

Future issues:
Lower air-box needs to be replaced since 3 screw holes are now stripped out. I thought it had rod knock at one point but it turns out that the cam chain tensioner is not automatic and needs manual adjustment over time. Bike runs 15 degrees hotter than my Hornet does when we're on a group ride, often close to or just over 100C where mine sits around 85C. Front wiggles/shakes (not violent, light wiggle) at higher speed (80kph+/50mph+) when letting go of the handlebars. Coolant slowly goes somewhere, radiator cap is suspect.
 

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1993 Zx-7 L Model, 2006 ZX-10R
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Hello everyone, posting for my friend since he has no clue about mechanics or how things operate and I am the designated mechanic for simple/easy things that dont need a shop.

The bike in question is a 2007 Ebony ZX6R with 96,000km (60,000mi), all original parts except for cooling hoses that were oil damaged, battery, coils and a muffler.

Code 63 Question:
Last year (2020) in August we replaced the stock muffler with a used stock muffler (replacement was not used beyond one month, used muffler owner replaced the stock muffler quickly after purchasing their bike) that included the cables to the servo. The original muffler eventually had the valve stick closed due to rust and throw a code 63 with MASSIVE power loss. During replacement I opened up the servo motor since it didn't feel "clean" when I was feeling how it rotated when keying on (felt a bit crunchy), come to find out a couple teeth were chipped on the plastic driven (larger) gear (probably due to the rusted valve), drive gear looked OK. I disassembled the servo and flipped the gear over 180 degrees to put some wear on the other unused side and added some new grease.

Today (June 3rd, 2021) he came back from a 4 hour ride with the FI light blinking and code 63 again but no power loss as before. Kawasaki shows that the original part has been superseded with a new part number (old 211740003 ,new 21174-0005) but it costs €264.20 ($322.10). I do not want to replace this with a used servo just to have the same plastic gears break again in a year. Is there a good quality aftermarket servo for this bike? I can only find used parts or elimination kits, we CANNOT use the elimination kit because it could fail the yearly inspection due to modifications, as I understand it any major modification (muffler, tire sizes, color, weight etc) to the bike needs to be measured, approved, and the registration updated and re-issued by the government with the new information.

#3 Coil On Plug Question:
In 4 years this bike has "eaten" 3 coils and they have ALL been for cylinder #3. we replaced the valve cover gasket (also 3rd time) this Feb since it was leaking HORRIBLY and Kawasaki here in Europe refused to do anything about it even though there is a TSB/Recall (MC 08-16) about the problem in the USA. Each time the coil holes had been oily but #3 and #4 were always filled with oil. I was thinking that the oil ingress was killing the coils but why only #3? When #3 failed the first time I had him order a complete coil set and we replaced them all at once, after that we only replaced #3 when it failed. The last failure has happened AFTER the valve cover gasket change and there was no oil on the coil. I did an ohm test of the coil and it matches the others so the primary windings should be OK, I did re-gap the plugs since they were getting a bit close to out of limits. Could there be an issue with the harness? I have not checked the charging system yet. Maybe it is just a fluke and these coils have been defective? That is why I would like your help/input on this.

Thank you very much for reading this far, I know it was long winded but I am getting close to the limit of what I can do with the tools and equipment that I have. There are a couple other issues that I will more than likely also need some help on but I need to make sure that the front tire is not the cause of them first.

Future issues:
Lower air-box needs to be replaced since 3 screw holes are now stripped out. I thought it had rod knock at one point but it turns out that the cam chain tensioner is not automatic and needs manual adjustment over time. Bike runs 15 degrees hotter than my Hornet does when we're on a group ride, often close to or just over 100C where mine sits around 85C. Front wiggles/shakes (not violent, light wiggle) at higher speed (80kph+/50mph+) when letting go of the handlebars. Coolant slowly goes somewhere, radiator cap is suspect.
1. I don't know of any aftermarket exhaust servo parts that would have a better design. I would look into other marketplaces to try to find it at a lower price if you haven't done so already.

2. Electrical gremlins. Have you swapped the bad coil on #3 with one of the other ones to check if it works? This is worse than my zx7 going through a starter relay every 12mos.

3. If the cooling system design is anything like my 06 ZX-10R, the bike does not like stop and go traffic. Mine will usually read between 82⁰C - 100⁰C. The longer the light, the hotter the bike will get.

Low speed front end shake would have be something with the top half of the triple tree assembly. A worn bearing probably. Taking a guess here as I've never experienced this problem and have seen some videos of it on YouTube.

Replace the the radiator cap if there's no evidence of the coolant leaking from somewhere else.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
So, sorry for the delay guys, got back from vacation. I did find one of the root causes for the failure of the servos! And it is NOT due to broken gears although that is one of the failure modes. The electric motor inside is poorly designed and eats itself alive as it is working.

As you can see this is probably the "standard" failure of these servos, the driven gear breaks and is not able to engage with the driving gear any longer. My solution here was to flip the gear 180 from normal and put the wear on the other side, the gear does not make a full rotation so the broken teeth shouldn't be a problem here.
19933


Now for the goodies:
19934
19935
19936


The "brushes", if you could even call them that, have been worn completely through until the copper backing plate, this creates severe wear on the commutator and the copper debris is also conductive and is probably shorting the motor out. This would explain the intermittent failure, and how the motor fails to even make a noise during its power on self-test. A broken gear will still make noise.

Another thing that I find interesting, the bike is a 2007, this motor has a manufacture date of 11/24/11, so this has already been replaced at least once on this bike, very poor design from Kawa if they fail so often. No wonder the elimination kits are so popular!

He purchased a "new" used servo motor off of a crashed ninja with 20,000km so I hope this part lasts a while. Just installed it today.

As for the misfire issues, everything is running ok for now, just going to wait and see what happens here.

Cooling system was found to not hold pressure and was slowly losing coolant through evaporation/boiling. There was a dent/gouge in the sealing surface where the radiator cap seals to the radiator, this was not letting the system build pressure. After fixing this with some solder and smoothing it out with sandpaper it now holds pressure and temps have dropped about 5 degrees during a ride, there is also no smell of coolant when stopped.
 

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1993 Zx-7 L Model, 2006 ZX-10R
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2008 Honda Hornet
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Hey, things are going well. The Ninja keeps wanting new parts left and right LOL. Coming down a mountain the clutch release arm sheared the top off of the clutch release rod, replaced that and everything is good again. Clutch plates and discs looked quite well for having over 90k-kms on them! Cooling system seems to be loosing coolant somewhere, you can smell it after a ride and the level has sloooowly dropped over time. No drips or obvious leaks though, thinking of putting in some UV-dye and tracking it that way. No misfires at the moment and the exhaust servo is working as it should.

In other news, my Honda is doing Honda things :p being quiet and unassuming :D although it is due for its yearly inspection next month, hope nothing is wrong with it.
 

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If you can smell it, it's getting hot. If it's getting hot, it's dripping/leaking on something hot. So that leaves you with the entirety of the engine and exhaust :).

Does your exhaust smell sweet?
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
The exhaust doesn't smell sweet thankfully, I do not feel like changing a head gasket on it :p We're thinking he should buy a complete coolant hose set (apart from the ones we've already changed) and we can start replacing them over this winter. It wouldn't surprise me if a hose has a tiny tiny weep by a clamp or has rubbed through enough to slowly leak. And with the age of the bike some of these hoses are probably near end of life anyways.

I am going to borrow a coolant pressure tester from a friend and put that on, let it sit overnight and see if it drops. Since it seems to only "leak" when hot I am hoping that it is due to higher pressure and this will show it.
 

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The exhaust doesn't smell sweet thankfully, I do not feel like changing a head gasket on it :p We're thinking he should buy a complete coolant hose set (apart from the ones we've already changed) and we can start replacing them over this winter. It wouldn't surprise me if a hose has a tiny tiny weep by a clamp or has rubbed through enough to slowly leak. And with the age of the bike some of these hoses are probably near end of life anyways.

I am going to borrow a coolant pressure tester from a friend and put that on, let it sit overnight and see if it drops. Since it seems to only "leak" when hot I am hoping that it is due to higher pressure and this will show it.
All very good suggestions. I just got done replacing all the hoses and gaskets on my 7 several months ago. It was a snowball effect. I replaced the offending hose, something else would fail. I did that for about a month.
 
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