ZZR1200 forks II - ZX Forums
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post #1 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-20-2019, 07:30 PM Thread Starter
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ZZR1200 forks II

Hi guys, a while back I changed my ZX11 forks over to '02 ZZR1200 forks. The change was fantastic. It actually absorbed bumps and rough surfaces, instead of jack-hammering me and the rest of the bike.
So a couple of weeks ago, I found a good deal on a set of '05 ZZR1200 forks which came with adjustable rebound. I had heard that there really wasn't much, if any, difference between the two types but I figured more adjustability is (potentially) better.

I disassembled and rebuilt the forks and both were full of sludgy oil. One had a bluish colored oil (like the Maxima 7wt that I replaced it with) while the other had a slightly yellowish oil. Both came apart and went back together easily.

I had wanted to disassemble the damping cartridge just to see how the rebound damping works, but it looks like it's sealed so I'll have to buy a junk fork to butcher (anybody have one they want to donate to the cause of science?). There is a long, thin tube that runs from the rebound adjuster screw, down through the damping rod, and to what feels like a spring loaded foot valve at the bottom of the damping cartridge.

I found that there is a substantial difference in the speed of rebound between when the rod is fully extended and fully depressed. That makes me think that the feature may actually be useful in conjunction with proper oil weight, etc.
I'll report on how it actually works when I get the forks installed.

Now, a question for all you suspension experts- why do so many manufacturers provide rebound damping and not compression damping when they offer only one adjustment? Kawasaki did so on both the shocks and forks of both the ZX11 and ZZR1200 ( and probably others, but I'm too tired to research right now).

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post #2 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-27-2019, 03:27 PM Thread Starter
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Ok guys, I finally had a chance to install and test the forks. The verdict is that the rebound adjustment does work and is noticeable, but the effects are not as transformative as the night-and-day difference with initial swap from ZX11 to ZZR1200 equipment.

The rebound settings have only a small amount of adjustment- fully closed is somewhat slow on recovery over rolling dips, but if I go more than two turns out the rebound control seems to disappear. Unscrewing it any more than that produces no discernable effect, at least with the 7wt oil I'm using.

I've settled on spring pre-load of 1 line visible (full hard- I weigh 250lb), and 3/4 turn out on the rebound setting. I think what I really need is some stiffer springs, so I don't have to use as much pre-load. As for further juggling oil viscosity and rebound settings, I don't think I'm good enough of a rider to really benefit from that. I'll just stay with what I have since it works well for me, and maybe consider some springs at a later date.

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post #3 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-27-2019, 06:09 PM
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What is exactly needed for the fork swap from a 2002-2005 , does one just require the fork tubes or is the triple and balance of hardware different. Can the original 4 pot ZX1100D calipers be bolted up? I ask because I just received my LSL Conversion bar kit with 2 longer lines for brake master to each caliper. I did not find any info that I may require a longer clutch line, currently running risers and all is fine with stock lines
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post #4 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-27-2019, 07:55 PM Thread Starter
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The ZZR1200 forks just slide into the ZX11 tripple clamps, no mods needed. I highly recommend the swap, just make sure you change seals and fluid. And if you're on the heavy side like me at 250lbs, see about some slightly stiffer springs.

The ZX11 calipers do not fit because the bolt holes differ, but from what I understand GSXR1000 six piston calipers will bolt on without mods.

I have no experience with the LSL bars, although others on this board do. I installed Concours bars on mine along with longer clutch cable.

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post #5 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-28-2019, 10:04 AM
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Originally Posted by M.Rad. View Post
The ZZR1200 forks just slide into the ZX11 tripple clamps, no mods needed. I highly recommend the swap, just make sure you change seals and fluid. And if you're on the heavy side like me at 250lbs, see about some slightly stiffer springs.

The ZX11 calipers do not fit because the bolt holes differ, but from what I understand GSXR1000 six piston calipers will bolt on without mods.

I have no experience with the LSL bars, although others on this board do. I installed Concours bars on mine along with longer clutch cable.
Thanks for the reply, did you do an aftermarket clutch line or the ZZR1200 stock line? I find the suspension the bike has to be decent, i dont know history of mine as far as suspension mods but the rear seems better than what many comment on and front seems decent enough. I am wondering if it may be an upgraded rear shock and springs to the front.

I dont think i want to bother w the caliper upgrade. I have to leave the bike bone stock to qualify for "vintage / collector" plates as of 12/20 then its peanuts for full coverage. After that I can make some mods but having paid so little for the bike i question if it is really worth it after selling a zx14 that had it all. Overall i am pretty happy w it but compared to my 97 Blackbird its not as smooth but seating position is very good. Picking up the bar conversion kit and considering the ZZR1200 header w some slip ons or a full Hindle left exit system which are on clearance.
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post #6 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-28-2019, 04:52 PM Thread Starter
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I used the clutch line from a Concours also. If you're happy with the suspension, then that's all that matters. As for the caliper upgrade, I doubt anyone but a ZX11 expert would know if they had been changed.
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post #7 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-28-2019, 06:55 PM
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...The ZX11 calipers do not fit because the bolt holes differ, but from what I understand GSXR1000 six piston calipers will bolt on without mods...
Hmmm, they should fit. On my ZX11D, I installed ZZ-R1200 front calipers many years ago and it was a straight bolt-on.
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post #8 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-29-2019, 09:59 AM
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Hmmm, they should fit. On my ZX11D, I installed ZZ-R1200 front calipers many years ago and it was a straight bolt-on.
If I remember right... GSXR1000 2001-2002 are direct bolt on for zzr1200. But to add the GSXR or zz1200 to zx11 different bolts are required as the zx11 uses M8 bolts and the GSXR and ZZ1200 use M10. I have seen old timers posts referring to selling the adapter bolt "kits" to match them up. Forks and calipers are on my list of things I am search for a deal....
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post #9 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-29-2019, 03:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Regulator View Post
If I remember right... GSXR1000 2001-2002 are direct bolt on for zzr1200. But to add the GSXR or zz1200 to zx11 different bolts are required as the zx11 uses M8 bolts and the GSXR and ZZ1200 use M10. I have seen old timers posts referring to selling the adapter bolt "kits" to match them up. Forks and calipers are on my list of things I am search for a deal....
Not sure the ZZR1200, but the ZX11 use M10 and the GSXR 1000 K1/K2 use M8. I had to use an adapter kit from a UK shop that doesn't exist anymore.
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post #10 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-29-2019, 04:52 PM
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If I remember right... GSXR1000 2001-2002 are direct bolt on for zzr1200. But to add the GSXR or zz1200 to zx11 different bolts are required as the zx11 uses M8 bolts and the GSXR and ZZ1200 use M10. I have seen old timers posts referring to selling the adapter bolt "kits" to match them up. Forks and calipers are on my list of things I am search for a deal....
Shit! You are damn right; I had a brain fart... It's been so long ago...

ZZ-R1200 calipers and ZX-11D calipers both have 62 mm spacing between both mounting bolts (same for 2001-2002 GSX-R1000 6 pots).
So, they were a "bolt-on" on my ZX11D but only after I drilled and tapped the holes (on ZZ-R1200 calipers) to M10 x 1.25 threads as ZX-11's OEM and I used ZX-11D bolts.

Again, sorry for my mistake.
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post #11 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-29-2019, 06:16 PM
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No big deal, I guess you see what I have been looking at... Old stuff!!! Zx12r. Forks are something I have on my list of things I can wait until I see a deal... The stock brakes saved my life more then once at speeds well over 100 when I was a bullet proof lad. Now I bleed.... I do notice a little chatter before brakes fully engage. Keep us posted with your progress!
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post #12 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-30-2019, 09:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Claude View Post
Quote:
Originally Posted by Regulator View Post
If I remember right... GSXR1000 2001-2002 are direct bolt on for zzr1200. But to add the GSXR or zz1200 to zx11 different bolts are required as the zx11 uses M8 bolts and the GSXR and ZZ1200 use M10. I have seen old timers posts referring to selling the adapter bolt "kits" to match them up. Forks and calipers are on my list of things I am search for a deal....
Shit! You are damn right; I had a brain fart... It's been so long ago...

ZZ-R1200 calipers and ZX-11D calipers both have 62 mm spacing between both mounting bolts (same for 2001-2002 GSX-R1000 6 pots).
So, they were a "bolt-on" on my ZX11D but only after I drilled and tapped the holes (on ZZ-R1200 calipers) to M10 x 1.25 threads as ZX-11's OEM and I used ZX-11D bolts.

Again, sorry for my mistake.

great info, now the question is can one find a used quality set of 6 pot gsxr 1000 brakes that dont require a full overhaul, or are the double pot ZZR1200 calipers any better ? i figure ss lines, new pads and fluid may be enough for me but if i find cheap enough perhaps...

Last edited by Cisco Kidd; 10-30-2019 at 10:31 AM.
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post #13 of 24 (permalink) Old 10-30-2019, 07:23 PM Thread Starter
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Depends what you mean by "full overhaul". There isn't much in a caliper that can go wrong except for seals, or at the worst corroded pistons. At that point you are probably better of getting a different used set than rebuilding (IMO).
I would never run used brake calipers without first opening them up and inspecting them. At the very least you can clean everything and re-assemble with the same parts if they are serviceable, although a seal kit doesn't cost that much. Otherwise they may have dirt inside and / or damaged components that could fail.
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post #14 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-01-2019, 10:07 AM
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Depends what you mean by "full overhaul". There isn't much in a caliper that can go wrong except for seals, or at the worst corroded pistons. At that point you are probably better of getting a different used set than rebuilding (IMO).
I would never run used brake calipers without first opening them up and inspecting them. At the very least you can clean everything and re-assemble with the same parts if they are serviceable, although a seal kit doesn't cost that much. Otherwise they may have dirt inside and / or damaged components that could fail.
I agree with you a 100%, more so the time opening inspecting with possibility of replacing seals if one is that far, but definitely would not go with a fleabay set un-inspected. I figure the stock 4 pot Tokicos must be decent enough with 2 direct to caliper SS lines and fresh fluid and pads. What are you running on your ZX11, it is funny after picking up this near 25 yr old bike how it has renewed my interest to improve it at minimal cost and then just enjoy riding it! Spring cant come quick enough next year
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post #15 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-02-2019, 12:36 AM
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WeBike has some adapters for Brembo conversion .
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post #16 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-02-2019, 08:03 PM Thread Starter
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I'm running ZZR1200 calipers that came with the forks. I'm not a "street Rossi" so they're just fine for my needs.

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post #17 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-03-2019, 05:44 AM Thread Starter
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Cisco Kidd- I see in your sig that you own three of, what many would consider, ultimate street bikes. Can you post your impressions of them?

For example, I know that the Blackbird engine is smoother than the ZX11 but how much smoother? Tremendously smoother or just noticeably smoother? Which one feels quicker in everyday conditions, etc.

I'm sure the ZX14 accelerates quicker from a start than either of the other two but again, how is it under normal road conditions? Do the better brakes make that much difference in daily use, etc.

Since you got the ZX11 after the other newer, more developed bikes, what made you add it to your collection? Are you still satisfied when riding it, or do you just want to get off and get on something "better".

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post #18 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-03-2019, 08:11 AM
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I have a set of zzr1200 forks if anyone is interested.
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post #19 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-03-2019, 09:26 AM
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Excellent stuff. But why the rossi hate it just sounds like
you got dusted real bad by someone much younger perhaps riding on
their first sportsbike and you're taking it personally. Is that your
job, are you cop. Got any good donut recommendations this morning. I notice
you never post a video of you on your bike going for a ride. Is that against department
regulations? Ok, so if there's no riding on the street are there tracks for the cash biker or the
is it only credit card biking.

Thank for your time Mr. Ad

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Very nice. I want a ZX12R.
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post #20 of 24 (permalink) Old 11-03-2019, 01:42 PM
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Originally Posted by M.Rad. View Post
Cisco Kidd- I see in your sig that you own three of, what many would consider, ultimate street bikes. Can you post your impressions of them?

For example, I know that the Blackbird engine is smoother than the ZX11 but how much smoother? Tremendously smoother or just noticeably smoother? Which one feels quicker in everyday conditions, etc.

I'm sure the ZX14 accelerates quicker from a start than either of the other two but again, how is it under normal road conditions? Do the better brakes make that much difference in daily use, etc.

Since you got the ZX11 after the other newer, more developed bikes, what made you add it to your collection? Are you still satisfied when riding it, or do you just want to get off and get on something "better".
Hey M.Rad I no longer own the other 2 bikes but I would be glad to give my impressions and reasons for getting the ZX11

I owned a 97 Blackbird which I LOVED and regret selling. It was pretty modified with custom cnc'd risers w LSL bars, a 2012 entire Busa front endw Busa fender w the radial brakes, Penske 8983 double adjustable rear shock, Factory ignition advancer, Dyna Coils, Yosh 4-1, K&N filter and Stage 2 jet kit. Numerous additional mods included delinked brake system, Carbon fibre inner fairing panels, Pazzo shorties w custom brake master, HEL stainless steel custom brake line kit, Gilles adjustable rear sets, a custom rear brake bracket to allow a Brembo rear brake conversion kit and Samco silicone rad hose kit and upgraded mosfet kit. Corbin seat and a custom windshield. The XX was fast enough, I think a tad quicker than the ZX11. I liked the gearbox, it was solid. My ZX is pretty much stock. Fit and finish goes to the Honda hands down, Smoothness goes to the Honda and its stock brakes were better than the stock ZX, the linked were okay but I delinked to go separate. I feel the XX looks better in stock form as well but thats subjective. I sold XX at 110,000km , my buddies 02 looked and rode mint at 210,000 and he did his first timing chain at 190,000. The XX is a really really good bike and I would buy another at the right price with all the right mods done in advance, BUT I would want a 97 so it could qualify for collector/vintage plates sooner.

My sole reason I sold the ZX14 was I found I have not been riding as much as I used to and the 08 ZX14 was farkled right out with the front AK-20 Axxion Cartridge Kit Ohlins rear suspension, dual fan rad mod, Sargent seat, PC, Yosh slip ons, risers, full Givi luggage, Yosh undertail , LED's , heated grips/vest and radar plug in and custom screen. The ZX14 is really really good and after getting off the ZX11 before I sold the 14 and then riding it back to back it is like night and day w FI. The one drawback of the ZX14 for me was the disgusting amount of heat the engine throws out in city driving, when you get stuck in traffic it is horrible. It is another level well past the XX and ZX11, the extra displacement throws off alot of heat. The bike imho handled amazingly well , comfort with my mods was excellent and smoothness was great. The ZX11 to date I am really enjoying it and cant wait until Dec 2020 when it qualifies for collector plate and real cheap insurance. I can then complete some of the mods I am collecting and I feel the bike will be all I need, fast, comfortable and better handling than it currently is. Nothing wrong with the ZX11 at all, I am happy I bought it , i did find the XX to feel smaller. I owned the XX and ZX14 together for a short period then sold the XX and had the ZX14 along with the ZX11 for a short period then sold it. The ZX14 is just so strong it wild, I don't require that type of power any more as I get older and you just cant use it on the streets and still be responsible but when you do find the right stretch of road as it is with all three of these bikes , wow what fun:)

My mods for the ZX are
Oxford heated grips
Corbin Seat
Givi Touring Screen & Lockhard Philips screen
LSL Conversion bar kit 2 lines for brakes
Roadsmart II

Hindle 4-1 new or ZZR 1200 header w Delkevic 13" tri ovals
Factory Pro jet kit
Factory Ignition advancer
Dyna DC1-2 coils

Last edited by Cisco Kidd; 11-03-2019 at 03:09 PM.
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