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Old 10-26-2010, 12:48 PM   #1 (permalink)
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Exclamation zx9 c1 rear suspesion

hi everyone. I have a rrv fireblade and zx9r c1 model. Power wise the 9 is way better than the blade, it pops wheelies everytime i open the throtle more, the blade wont do that, but the blade is better handling wise. Now what can i do with the 9 to feel it better around the bends, every time when im in the bend with more leaning angle it feels very wobly on the back, a bit unstable and it feels a bit like a back wheel is sliding along, what can i do to correct it? I was thinking about fitting the rear shock absorber of the different model like E model, but i dont know will it fit, or maybe shock of zx10, have anyone done anything like this before?? I need help with that cos i love my nine, but if i wont feel it around the bends it wont be any good for me. help please

ps. oh and try to ignore my writing style, english is not my mother language
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Old 10-26-2010, 01:07 PM   #2 (permalink)
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ya i have this question too, i have 98, and my rear shock is completely wore out. i want something that will be stronger for drag racing/road racing
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Old 10-26-2010, 02:17 PM   #3 (permalink)
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Zako- More than one thing could cause the handling symptoms you are describing, but I can help you with your shock replacement choices.

Tilikum98- Your needs are a bit different, since you are trying to drop the bike significantly in the rear to drag, while keeping it stiff, but I know of options for you, too.

In either case, your best bet for replacement is a quality Ohlins, Penske or Elka. If the price of those shocks is prohibitive, I suggest a newer stock shock be used. Here's the deal:

- Any newer ZX9 or ZX10 model shock is going to be longer than the stock '98-'99 ZX9 shock. Using one of these slightly longer shocks will raise the rear ride height on the '98-'99 models to match the stock height of the '00-'03 ZX9's. For the C models, this added rear ride height generally improves handling greatly!

- All 2000-2003 ZX9 and 2004-2010 ZX10 shocks are made by Kayaba (KYB) and are the same length. It is important to note that the 2006-2007 ZX10 shocks have a different reservoir position than the 2004-2005 and 2008-2010 versions, so you will want to stick with the '04-'05 and '08-'10 versions for your ZX9. The largest differences between the '04-'05 and the '08-up ZX10 shocks are that the '08-up came with a slightly softer spring rate (9.1 kg/mm vs. 10.0 kg/mm on the '04-'05) and features both high and low speed compression adjustment.

- All 2003-04 ZX6 (636 and 6RR) are made by Kayaba (KYB). All 2005-up ZX6 (636 and 6RR) are made by Showa. Regardless of brand, all '03-up ZX6 model shocks are about an inch shorter than the ZX9/ZX10 shocks. The 6RR versions are fully interchangable with the 636 versions, but typically feature stiffer springs than their non-RR brothers.

- To fit any '03-up ZX6 or '04-up ZX10 shock on any '98-'03 ZX9, you will need to use the newer style bottom mounting bushing, which is 2mm narrower (30mm) than your stock bushing (32mm). This bushing simply slides out of your stock ZX9 linkage and the new one slides right back in. While you are making the change, I strongly recommend upgrading to the newer style grease seals, as well, to ensure proper clearance of the shock fork. Again, simply pop out the old seals and the new ones fit right back in on your stock linkage. For the clevis (the forked piece at the top with threads), be sure to reuse your stock ZX9 unit, as different years of ZX6 and ZX10 have different offsets that may cause clearance issues with the ZX9 swingarm.

For the C1...don't just get another ZX9 shock. They wear out and no one wants to rebuild/upgrade them. Even the earliest ZX10 shocks are a better design and more easily rebuilt.

If you are trying to lower the back and keep it stiff at the same time, opt for an '03-up ZX6 shock, which is a bit shorter than the others, and simply place shims (washers that fit are available at both Lowe's and Home Depot) between the clevis and upper shock mount until the desired ride height is achieved.

Hope this helps.

~ C ~

Last edited by Masta' C; 10-26-2010 at 02:24 PM.
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Old 10-26-2010, 03:29 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Masta' C View Post
Zako- More than one thing could cause the handling symptoms you are describing, but I can help you with your shock replacement choices.

Tilikum98- Your needs are a bit different, since you are trying to drop the bike significantly in the rear to drag, while keeping it stiff, but I know of options for you, too.

In either case, your best bet for replacement is a quality Ohlins, Penske or Elka. If the price of those shocks is prohibitive, I suggest a newer stock shock be used. Here's the deal:

- Any newer ZX9 or ZX10 model shock is going to be longer than the stock '98-'99 ZX9 shock. Using one of these slightly longer shocks will raise the rear ride height on the '98-'99 models to match the stock height of the '00-'03 ZX9's. For the C models, this added rear ride height generally improves handling greatly!

- All 2000-2003 ZX9 and 2004-2010 ZX10 shocks are made by Kayaba (KYB) and are the same length. It is important to note that the 2006-2007 ZX10 shocks have a different reservoir position than the 2004-2005 and 2008-2010 versions, so you will want to stick with the '04-'05 and '08-'10 versions for your ZX9. The largest differences between the '04-'05 and the '08-up ZX10 shocks are that the '08-up came with a slightly softer spring rate (9.1 kg/mm vs. 10.0 kg/mm on the '04-'05) and features both high and low speed compression adjustment.

- All 2003-04 ZX6 (636 and 6RR) are made by Kayaba (KYB). All 2005-up ZX6 (636 and 6RR) are made by Showa. Regardless of brand, all '03-up ZX6 model shocks are about an inch shorter than the ZX9/ZX10 shocks. The 6RR versions are fully interchangable with the 636 versions, but typically feature stiffer springs than their non-RR brothers.

- To fit any '03-up ZX6 or '04-up ZX10 shock on any '98-'03 ZX9, you will need to use the newer style bottom mounting bushing, which is 2mm narrower (30mm) than your stock bushing (32mm). This bushing simply slides out of your stock ZX9 linkage and the new one slides right back in. While you are making the change, I strongly recommend upgrading to the newer style grease seals, as well, to ensure proper clearance of the shock fork. Again, simply pop out the old seals and the new ones fit right back in on your stock linkage. For the clevis (the forked piece at the top with threads), be sure to reuse your stock ZX9 unit, as different years of ZX6 and ZX10 have different offsets that may cause clearance issues with the ZX9 swingarm.

For the C1...don't just get another ZX9 shock. They wear out and no one wants to rebuild/upgrade them. Even the earliest ZX10 shocks are a better design and more easily rebuilt.

If you are trying to lower the back and keep it stiff at the same time, opt for an '03-up ZX6 shock, which is a bit shorter than the others, and simply place shims (washers that fit are available at both Lowe's and Home Depot) between the clevis and upper shock mount until the desired ride height is achieved.

Hope this helps.

~ C ~
Thanks for your reply mate, very very usefull information know what to do now. But what about the other things that might be the couse of my handling issues?? Could you name some of them, i went back to all stock settings and its a bit better now, position of the back wheel was out a bit and i have sort that out allready an its getting better, both of the tyres was different, same brand but different models so i went for a set of a same pirrelis dialblo III, but im still gettin the funny feeling that the back wheel is sliding off, the bike feels like its drops into the bends an the spring is spoongy as fu****
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Old 10-26-2010, 03:53 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Well, you've already addressed some of the things I'd recommend. Tell me...what's your weight? What size tires are you running and at what pressures? Did you change out both tires with brand new ones? Any other suspension changes (fork springs, etc...)? Is your chain adjusted within the proper range?

Axle alignment, shock/fork settings, ride height, front-to-rear suspension balance, tire profile and tire wear can all be factors contributing to what you are feeling!

Curious about the shock feeling spongy, though, which is why I ask about your weight. Of course, even if the spring rate is close to what you need, if the hydraulic function of the shock is worn out or working insufficiently, the shock isn't going to be able to control the rear end's movement as it should, which could easily result in poor handling.
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Old 10-26-2010, 04:17 PM   #6 (permalink)
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Get a shock of a zx-12r. Fits straight in and gives you height adjustment. The C's handle better with the rear raised a bit :)
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Old 10-26-2010, 05:26 PM   #7 (permalink)
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Get a shock of a zx-12r. Fits straight in and gives you height adjustment. The C's handle better with the rear raised a bit :)
The ZX12 shock is heavy and based on the same outdated technology as the ZX9's own shock. Get one of the ZX10 shocks I recommended. They'll raise the '98-'99 models up a bit in the rear from the start and you can further raise it, if desired, with simple washers (i.e. shims) that are available at any hardware store for a few cents each. The shocks work well and can be had for cheap.
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Old 10-26-2010, 11:33 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Masta' C View Post
Well, you've already addressed some of the things I'd recommend. Tell me...what's your weight? What size tires are you running and at what pressures? Did you change out both tires with brand new ones? Any other suspension changes (fork springs, etc...)? Is your chain adjusted within the proper range?

Axle alignment, shock/fork settings, ride height, front-to-rear suspension balance, tire profile and tire wear can all be factors contributing to what you are feeling!

Curious about the shock feeling spongy, though, which is why I ask about your weight. Of course, even if the spring rate is close to what you need, if the hydraulic function of the shock is worn out or working insufficiently, the shock isn't going to be able to control the rear end's movement as it should, which could easily result in poor handling.
Well im 82 kg and 186 height. If its going about the suspension settings i went to stock ones, and it was spongee as fu******, so ive made bit of a adjustments on a spring and compresed it a bit and that helped a bit. The tyres are both the same ones pirelli diablo corsas III and they nice and round, not squared off
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Old 10-27-2010, 10:05 AM   #9 (permalink)
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By my calculations, you're 180 lbs. and just over 6 feet tall...pretty skinny guy...does that sound right?

I'm guessing the sponginess is due to bad shock hydraulics. The stock spring should be more than adequate for your weight! However, if the hydraulics can't stop it from bouncing up and down uncontrolled, you'll definitely get a spongy feeling, especially when transitioning the weight between the front and rear (i.e. when accelerating and braking).

If the shock isn't controlling movement sufficiently, it's absolutely time for a rebuild/replacement. Probably a good place to start before messing with other components. I don't imagine a 12-year-old shock would be up to par, anyways, regardless of mileage.

I would recommend fitting a 2008-2010 ZX10 shock to start. The stock spring on the '04-'05 is just way too stiff for your weight. It can be changed, but wouldn't make the switch as cost effective and the 2008-up shocks are easier to find with low mileage.

By the way, when you adjust spring preload, always be sure to keep an eye on your sag settings...
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Old 10-27-2010, 01:00 PM   #10 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Masta' C View Post
By my calculations, you're 180 lbs. and just over 6 feet tall...pretty skinny guy...does that sound right?

I'm guessing the sponginess is due to bad shock hydraulics. The stock spring should be more than adequate for your weight! However, if the hydraulics can't stop it from bouncing up and down uncontrolled, you'll definitely get a spongy feeling, especially when transitioning the weight between the front and rear (i.e. when accelerating and braking).

If the shock isn't controlling movement sufficiently, it's absolutely time for a rebuild/replacement. Probably a good place to start before messing with other components. I don't imagine a 12-year-old shock would be up to par, anyways, regardless of mileage.

I would recommend fitting a 2008-2010 ZX10 shock to start. The stock spring on the '04-'05 is just way too stiff for your weight. It can be changed, but wouldn't make the switch as cost effective and the 2008-up shocks are easier to find with low mileage.

By the way, when you adjust spring preload, always be sure to keep an eye on your sag settings...
thanks for the info, my bike is already dropped in the rear, but the shock is super spongy. really bad, and i even have it on its tightest setting. now that i know about the zx6 shock, i plan to pick one up here in the next couple weeks. gotta start looking at ebay. also i am still interested in those springs and seals, just gotta wait like 2ish weeks till i have the funds.
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Old 10-27-2010, 01:52 PM   #11 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by Masta' C View Post
By my calculations, you're 180 lbs. and just over 6 feet tall...pretty skinny guy...does that sound right?

I'm guessing the sponginess is due to bad shock hydraulics. The stock spring should be more than adequate for your weight! However, if the hydraulics can't stop it from bouncing up and down uncontrolled, you'll definitely get a spongy feeling, especially when transitioning the weight between the front and rear (i.e. when accelerating and braking).

If the shock isn't controlling movement sufficiently, it's absolutely time for a rebuild/replacement. Probably a good place to start before messing with other components. I don't imagine a 12-year-old shock would be up to par, anyways, regardless of mileage.

I would recommend fitting a 2008-2010 ZX10 shock to start. The stock spring on the '04-'05 is just way too stiff for your weight. It can be changed, but wouldn't make the switch as cost effective and the 2008-up shocks are easier to find with low mileage.

By the way, when you adjust spring preload, always be sure to keep an eye on your sag settings...
you really are a MASTA C. But is the 2008 shock gonna be a stright swap or do i have to do some mods. Could give me some clues please?
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Old 10-27-2010, 03:42 PM   #12 (permalink)
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you really are a MASTA C. But is the 2008 shock gonna be a stright swap or do i have to do some mods. Could give me some clues please?
sorryy. That was a stupi question ;/ rotflmao

Thanks for all the answers
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Old 10-28-2010, 02:12 AM   #13 (permalink)
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No problem. If you can pick up a 2008 or newer ZX10 shock with at least the bottom knuckle linkage still connected to the shock, you can take it apart and simply swap the ZX10's bottom bushing and grease seals over to your stock ZX9 linkage. I DO NOT recommend trying to fit any other part of the ZX10 linkage assembly to your ZX9...ONLY the newer style bottom bushing and grease seals.
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Old 01-16-2011, 09:28 AM   #14 (permalink)
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hi everybody...you can also revalve your shock and put a new spring(i ve put hyperpro) it works great.
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Old 01-16-2011, 09:44 AM   #15 (permalink)
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When i put a 09 zx10 shock on my b3, i had to use the zx10 shock and linkage and get a new set of bolts (i didnt use the dog bones, but if you want your bike to set lower in the rear, the zx10 dogs are about a half inch longer, which puts the shock lower in the frame)
Mine was a straight drop, except for the bolts, which i just picked up at the local hardware store.
i found my shock on ebay, with like no miles on it, for $25 shipped and the linkage for $13 shipped.
bolts were about $10, you dont want to get anything weak, so i chose 12.9 i believe.
i haven't ridden on it yet, but just sitting on it is a noticeable difference.
on my b3, the zx10 shock wouldn't mount to the linkage because it was too wide, so i swapped the bearings in the linkage, but they were a different OD than the zx9's.
So i ended up just using the zx10 linkage.
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Old 03-05-2012, 06:13 AM   #16 (permalink)
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I know this is an old thread, but I'm wondering what's the current consensus is on the best, budget upgrade for the '94-'97 ZX9R rear suspension?
Thanks.
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Old 04-04-2013, 09:32 PM   #17 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by joefj1200 View Post
I know this is an old thread, but I'm wondering what's the current consensus is on the best, budget upgrade for the '94-'97 ZX9R rear suspension?
Thanks.
bump* for his help
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