Corner savvy

[Buckwheat]

While I know the ZX-14 is not designed as a road-track racer, who has realized success as such in the following areas of geometry:

1. Sag (Ft & Rear)

2. Tire sizes (190/50 vs. 190/55)

3. Ride height (Ft & Rear)

4. Tire Pressures (42/42 recommended by Kawi)

That should do it. Any experience appreciated!

[jollyroger]

Every ride I come back from is a "success"!(does that help?)

[Buckwheat]

yes, there's no substitute for seat time!

[BULLDOG]

Although a big bike that is supposed to not handle well according to some, I've scraped the crap out of the OEM pegs and my feet , many times, also my chicken strips are only on the front tire maybe 4mm,this bike is built tough and it handles superbly IMO.
Air in the front i think mine is at 36 and 42 rear, recently setmy preloads and its is a different bike.
.

[1882]

Setting the preload and running a 190/55 really transformed the bike for me. I run 36/38 psi. You can raise the forks a few mm in the clamps to help turn in but the 190/55 raises the rear a bit, not sure if doing both would make her too twitchy at speed?

[1882]

I've also noticed that due to the girth & wheelbase of the 14 much more body english is needed to really make her dance. Ya just have to move around on this bike compared to a literbike.

[jollyroger]

I've got mine set up with stock suspension-so no big deal there.I've got er set for someone around 225 or so.I'm 175 with gear.She's quite nimble actually.And the ride height is stock.Increased my front preload to 3 bars showing.Compression-6 clicks out.Rebound,about 10 clicks.Rear is stock settings.Ride quality is very smooth,very little dive in the frontend.No bottoming.She doesn't pitch about,or wallow in the sweepers.Holds a line great,and is sharp on the midcorner corrections.She'll lean as far as I can take er-at least to the tire edge there.Probably go further I'm pretty sure.Stable as a rock at speed.190/55's out back.Pirelli Angel ST's-new-I haven't been able yet to take er out for a romp yet-weather is changin fast around here.But she'll keep right up with Gixxers and the like.Course,they can't hang after a few switchbacks-so the fun there doesn't last long.

[Bikerboy4Life]

Originally Posted by Buckwheat

While I know the ZX-14 is not designed as a road-track racer, who has realized success as such in the following areas of geometry:

1. Sag (Ft & Rear)

2. Tire sizes (190/50 vs. 190/55)

3. Ride height (Ft & Rear)

4. Tire Pressures (42/42 recommended by Kawi)

That should do it. Any experience appreciated!

Buckwheat, I have realized the most important fact. . . . it's all personal preference-nothing is absolutely consistant. Because what one guy likes, another person will bawk about it. With that said, here is what I have experienced, and will share:

1) I had my "sag" front and rear tuned for [my] weight. . .ABSOLUTE, WORLD OF IMPROVEMENT!

2) I stuck with the mfg. recommended tire sizes but, I switched to Bridgestone BT-016's, front and rear. . . . WORLD of IMPROVEMENT, over the stock 014's. 016's are priced quite reasonable, imo. Performance is grade "A", imo. My 14 handles very responsively now, with much less effort than before.

3) Again, my suspension was tuned by my mechanic, for MY weight. It works. . . .and works well!

4) I have had the best results for my weight, and the road temp's in SoCal on any given nice day, @ 38 lbs. COLD measure, front and rear. I love those pressures. Although I will say, knee-draggers I know, will drop the tire pressure as low as 32/30 lbs. COLD measure. I don't knee drag. I just lean to the extent that is necessary to execute the turn safely.

This is just what works for me. I am 6'2", roughly 260 lbs. Good luck

[Bikerboy4Life]

Originally Posted by jollyroger

Every ride I come back from is a "success"!(does that help?)

I concur.

[Buckwheat]

Originally Posted by Bikerboy4Life

1) I had my "sag" front and rear tuned for [my] weight. . .ABSOLUTE, WORLD OF IMPROVEMENT!

Bikerboy4Life,

With the above being your case (& no need to know what spring rates or preload adjustments you are using), how much sag did your tuner recommend for both ends?

Thanks again.

[Buckwheat]

Originally Posted by BULLDOG

.

Nice!

[185EZ]

As previously stated, I also changed to 016's. I wondered when I first got the bike why I felt like the bike wouldn't do what I wanted. The 016s changed all that and it feels like a new great handling bike. I would bet ANY tire other than OEM 014s would be an improvement.

[Bikerboy4Life]

Originally Posted by Buckwheat

Bikerboy4Life,

With the above being your case (& no need to know what spring rates or preload adjustments you are using), how much sag did your tuner recommend for both ends?

Thanks again.

Well Wheat, He didn't verbally make a recommendation. I sat on the bike(twice). . . . . He did the adjustments after I got off of the bike, and I rode home after we settled the bill. What I can tell you is, for MY weight(260lbs), He had to stiffen the rear to MAXIMUM, and that definately brought up the ride height. There is NO SAG, in the rear of my 14 at all, when I mount her.
The front, idk . I believe there is more adjustment left, in the front.

He told me to try out the adjustments for a while, and if I was NOT satisfied, to bring the bike back. But I was/am definately satisfied with the bikes' handling and cornering, after His tuning. He also said, in order to get the rear ANY stiffer, I would have to swap out the factory spring for an aftermarket spring with a higher spring rate. But, as I stated, I don't feel that will be necessary now

[Buckwheat]

185EZ,

Thanks for that and I totally agree. My stock rubber is totally out of profile and cupped in the front despite not being at the wear bars. Better rubber certainly is in order. I always enjoy getting a new front tire!

Another part of my problem is tire pressures, I'm thinking that 42 is too high (especially in colder NW weather this time of year) so a lower pressure will help get more heat into the tire. Before I start to ramble, I'm just trying to save myself some time with the geometry set-up before spring comes around...at which time I'll fine tune the dampening settings to my preference (depending on temps, tarmac & turns).


Bikerboy4Life - Right on, that helps narrow in on the fact that I probably won't need new springs. I have heard opinions that ZX-14's are sprung too softly. (I weigh around 205 lbs. with gear on).

[Speedy14]

Originally Posted by Buckwheat

While I know the ZX-14 is not designed as a road-track racer, who has realized success as such in the following areas of geometry:

1. Sag (Ft & Rear)

2. Tire sizes (190/50 vs. 190/55)

3. Ride height (Ft & Rear)

4. Tire Pressures (42/42 recommended by Kawi)

That should do it. Any experience appreciated!

Buckwheat....

My weight is 230 (I'm 6'5'' not fat)

I set the bike to show 4 1/2'' sag on the front fork (measure the seal to fork area first while off the bike and then sit on it in your gear and adjust the preload to where it reads 4 1/2" of travel left. (for me it is about 3 1/2 lines showing on fork preload adjusters.) I run compression damping at 5 clicks out from full firm ( I have about 12k miles on the current fork oil and it has thinned out some) Rebound is set at 5 clicks out of forks. I tend to like my suspension rather firm.. New springs for the fork and new heavier fork oil as well as a new Penske or Works Performance shock are in the near future...

For the street the Rear shock should be adjusted for about 33mm sag [from unladen measurment] ie; measure from the ground to some point on the rear such as the screw on the rear turn signal etc.. Get a baseline reading Then sit on the bike in full gear and see how much it sags. [Do this several times and get an average]..It will differ some each measurment because of stiction in the suspension.. You want about 30 to 33mm of sag for street riding... When you are done setting preload you can simply have someone hold the bike up whle you push down on the tank to see if the front and the rear dips evenly to see if you are in the ball park.. If not re adjust.

Re; the ride height; I raised the front forks 14 mm from stock position and also installed Soupys Performance rear links that are turnbuckle style adjusters that allow you to raise or lower the rear.(when using this type of adjuster make sure to mic/measure both side to make sure it is even or else it could get in a bind) and have the rear raised 15 mm to make it turn in quicker..
The Zx14 has 23 degrees rake and will really turn in quickly if you get too much rear ride height but it is still pretty stable at high speeds (I do use a steering damper) IF the front end gets too high it will push out in the corners and run wide.. Make sure the rear shock compression damping is adjusted properly so you do not get a lot of weight transfer to the rear on acceleration and it will track pretty good coming out hard on the corners and hold the line well.

I run 39 to 40lbs pressure in rear tire on BTO 16's (a GREAT tire BTW) and 36 to 37 in the front.. I Lilkey the twisties and corners

For what it is, the 14 is a great handling (big and heavy) bike and when set up properly it is easy to pitch in to a corner. It will hold a nice line when set up right [and if you use your right wrist corectly and keep it smooth..] However, it will not ever be as easy a transition to get it lifted up from one quick turn to the next on the track like a ZX10 or R1 etc.. Just too heavy and long.... Of course if you strech it out then all the quick handling is compromised more for straight line acceleration.

Of course, these adjustments work for me and my bike but depending on how many miles you have on the current suspension and fork oil and your weight and riding style etc. you might need to dial in different damping on the fork and shock .. Good luck.. The 14 is a great overall sports bike that can do many things really well..

<Speedy><

[jollyroger]

#1 on that Speedy-good write up!Have mine setup almost like yours-I'm 175,185 maybe with gear on.Suspension works well for me also!

[OldPete2112]

Hey Buckwheat, sounds like you have the same questions that I had earlier. Here is what I did.

First off, get rid of the stock rubber, they certainly did not ever stick like my new Pirelli Diablo Rossos. Your choice of tires, many here run the Michelins and are plenty happy too, but the Pirellis made a BIG difference for me.

Second, get to a GOOD suspension set up guy. I had our local bike co op racer Scott at Adrenalin adjust my bike for me. I spent about an hour bouncing up and down on the bike, with him measuring and adjusting and measuring and adjusting again. And I have to say, this has made more of an improvement that I ever thought it would.

FYI, we are the same weight, I am about 5'10. There seems to be enough suspension in the bike now, but I like the ride a bit firm and may spend the extra next summer to upgrade the forks and rear shock, but for now this has made a big difference.

One last point, take some time to consider upgrading the brakes. I ended up changing mine over to Galfers this fall, along with Stainless lines and Pazzo levers. It sure makes a difference in the overall performance of the bike. Remember braking is an important part of performance, and may sometime be far more important than acceleration.

OP

[mad]

For a bike such as ours, sag should be between 25 (track) to 35 (street)mm front and rear. From the factory, I found front sag to be WAY too high and rear non-existent for my 175lb weight. I reset front and rear sag to 30mm. I then set damping to my preferences.

I replaced both my tires with BT-016s as noted above. I went up to a 190/55 for the rear and the bike performs flawlessly and fits with my rear hugger no problems.

I'd still like to install some adjustable links for the rear suspension to raise the rear ride height a bit.

Hope that helps.

[Cutback]

Originally Posted by mad

For a bike such as ours, sag should be between 25 (track) to 35 (street)mm front and rear. From the factory, I found front sag to be WAY too high and rear non-existent for my 175lb weight. I reset front and rear sag to 30mm. I then set damping to my preferences.

I replaced both my tires with BT-016s as noted above. I went up to a 190/55 for the rear and the bike performs flawlessly and fits with my rear hugger no problems.

I'd still like to install some adjustable links for the rear suspension to raise the rear ride height a bit.

Hope that helps.

I weigh 155lbs, run 30mm front sag, 38mm rear sag, BT-016's, 34,36 psi.

[Buckwheat]

Excellent work Mad. Just the experience I was looking for. While it's too cold to ride up here now, I have a good idea of what baseline settings to achieve over the winter. ...already looking forward to Spring. Thanks to all for your suggestions.