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Old 05-25-2013, 02:58 PM   #1 (permalink)
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zx11 oiling mods

ok i know there is info here and there, please list all oil mods you have done from pans to internal, if you have pic's would be great also, one is upgrading the relief valve to a 98 or newer zx11 and adding a .006 spacer i am assuming that spacer is basically a thin washer
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Old 05-25-2013, 03:48 PM   #2 (permalink)
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I removed my balancer and plugged the feed im hoping it helps, my freinds at the race track allways say to me whats that sound oh its only your no3 rod rattling. I run 4.5 ltrs oil and a good synthetic but it still is a worry this topic is gona be a good help for both of us i hope.
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Old 05-25-2013, 04:16 PM   #3 (permalink)
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I haven't done squat...... Bone stock engine with over 60,000 miles on her....
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Old 05-25-2013, 06:56 PM   #4 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
ok i know there is info here and there,
please list all oil mods you have done..
It doesn't work like that.

If you know there is info... Maybe you should read it.
That way you get the education for yourself and your bike.
Instead of asking someone else to do the work for you.

I guess you're not really paying much attention to what information I have been giving you.
Or, the data you're capable of reading directly from the FSM.


Heads up:
Starting this thread... When you already have one going..
And, you've been given a heads up about duplicate threads.. Is lame, pal.
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Old 05-25-2013, 07:58 PM   #5 (permalink)
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Rick, its all good.... you've already walked into the bike garage and struck up a conversation. Would you typically strike up 3 separate conversations with different folks, or just start chatting with a few, & after overhearing the topic, more start wandering over and join the discussion?

Of course I don't drag race my bike, but I have kept the oil topped off, the front wheel on the ground, & always use the clutch when shifting. 3 big pointers to keeping your mill running happily for tens of thousands of miles, even if you do see redline quite a lot.

Kick back, grab a beer, and lets start getting greasy in your original thread...
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Old 05-26-2013, 07:03 AM   #6 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blainethemono View Post
I haven't done squat...... Bone stock engine with over 60,000 miles on her....
That's nice to know Blaine. Mine never sees the red line. Heck I put ZX11 Cams in my ZRX1100 and have a hard time hitting 7 grand on it. You see that's where the 20 ponies the cams are supposed to give the bike start to kick in. Don't know if they do. I might have got it past 7 grand in 2nd. Don't know I was watching the road in front of me, LOL.

On the ZX11 I can see I'll be putting in the stage 1 Factory Pro kit you recommended. Seems I'm mostly around the 4,500 RPM mark where the bike stumbles from factory jetting. I'm never even close to the red line on the ZX. I do roll-ons on the freeway up to 125-135 at times but never hog down on the throttle and grab a couple of gears to get there, just the roll-ons. Always shift with the clutch and love the buttery smooth trans in this bike.

Anyhow, glad to know with my type of riding I'll hopefully never need the oil passage updates. I'm not a wheelie guy either. I've flipped to many rented scooters in Florida to want to hurt my ZX11.

Here's my Sig on another site;

Besides, no matter how much stonk my engine has I'm still an old, slow guy. Takes more than horsepower to fix that.

Last edited by tickketplease; 05-26-2013 at 07:32 AM. Reason: Added Sig
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Old 05-26-2013, 08:19 AM   #7 (permalink)
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blaine this one is more so others can refferance it without going through my repair, i spent 6 hours yesterday combing the net to find tricks mods ect, and it always leads back to the same stuff and doesnt show any picture's, i consider myself semi-intelligent, been tinkering and working on cars over 20 years, but a bike isnt the same, a major mishap can lead to a serious problem especially at speeds, so i needed my hand held a little. plus no one ever said anything about using a 98 or newer oil relief valve, there's also a mod to the valve for the oil filter part 16123-1108 where the hole towards the threads gets elongated. another member sent me a few pictures that help in pointing stuff out, the main bearing cap hole doesnt really line up with the tube which i seen when i was taking it apart, so i opened it up a little. did have 1 hole not really line up case and bearing so have the elongate that bearing to match hole.

and to loius... lame ? neither of the threads have anything to do with this,and didnt get a single question answered on either thread, yes about same bike but this is to give a refferance along with pictures for anyone else reading. i mean goggle oil mods on a zx11. and you really get nothing, it's always about the #3 bearing, with no pictures and saying make sure holes line up and thats about it, and even though i have the repair manual it really doesnt show alot and seems to skips steps. so since i know what i have to do to my bike i figured it might help others once they end up doing their bike.
So sorry if this is annoying anyone
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Old 05-26-2013, 03:27 PM   #8 (permalink)
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Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
...So sorry if this is annoying anyone
It's not annoying, far from it. I don't see the purpose of blaming a discussion on a... discussion forum.
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Old 05-26-2013, 06:31 PM   #9 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
and to loius... lame ? neither of the threads have anything to do with this,and didnt get a single question answered on either thread
y'fookin kiddin me?
Didn't get answers?..
Your original thread:(with plenty of info)
http://www.zxforums.com/forums/zx-11...ml#post2030761
Referencing this: (which is exactly what you asked for; pics & info)
http://www.zxforums.com/forums/2018841-post37.html
Then your second thread in which you were given a hat-tip by Blaine about duplicate threads:
http://www.zxforums.com/forums/zx-11...ing-apart.html
Now this thread... (the one were on) being your third.


I'm not sure what more you need..
You have an idea about what you want to do.
What are you planning on doing? How are you planning on riding?

I think Blaine even coincidentally posted vids about what I PM'd you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
yes about same bike but this is to give a refferance along with pictures for anyone else reading.
i mean goggle oil mods on a zx11..and you really get nothing,
it's always about the #3 bearing, with no pictures
and saying make sure holes line up and thats about it.
Fck google.. Have you tried searching HERE?..
The reason why the no 3 fails, preventative measures,
and the different modification options and info have already been relayed to you.
That's why I find starting 3 different threads regarding your experience to the same problem redundant.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
and even though i have the repair manual
it really doesnt show alot and seems to skips steps.
It's a service manual, not a picture menu.

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
so since i know what i have to do to my bike
i figured it might help others once they end up doing their bike.
What's your plan for your motor?
Without revealing what you have to do..
How does this help others?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
So sorry if this is annoying anyone
You lay a guilt trip like my Jewish in-laws..

Your asking for help, for advice, for guidance...
I have nothing to gain by misleading you.

Best of luck.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Claude View Post
blaming a discussion
Is that possible?

Last edited by Lurky Louis; 05-30-2013 at 11:21 AM.
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Old 05-27-2013, 07:01 AM   #10 (permalink)
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not going to go into a pissing contest, and yes i used the search bar up top and it really doesnt show any mods, atleast not the one's ive just posted
as for my bike to answer you questions, sending crank to ape, i am removing the counter balance weight, even though it only did one bearing in i am replacing all the bearings with black one's can find any color on them so going with the largest, doing all of the mods except the mr tubo, which after looking at these and then seening my motor i can see where the issue was, plus i am going with the oil relief valve from a 2000 zx11.
my bike does have 40k on it and i ride it like i stole it, i am not a cruiser, im a ex drag racer and i live in the mountains so the bike gets used, i ride all year long

here are some photo's of some of the mods and will continue to add to it
http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/...e/zx11mod4.jpg

http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/...e/zx11mod2.jpg

http://i1098.photobucket.com/albums/...e/zx11mod1.jpg

Last edited by RickNYzx11; 05-27-2013 at 07:06 AM.
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Old 05-27-2013, 07:41 AM   #11 (permalink)
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Rick, if you search my post i think you can find alot of info and builds.

as for lurky, more useless post. you post the same thing over and over,you just trying to get your useless post count up? oh,why you telling everyone to get there crank lightened and balanced when yours isn't done? only thing you have are rods. this is a lightened crank.

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Old 05-27-2013, 08:53 AM   #12 (permalink)
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yeah i went through alot of yours kevin, and really appriciate the help you have given me lol they pic's you sent i found simular one's and a few others on the zl forum. i do have one question though and ive seen two ways to do it, when you take the counter balance out for the crank do you just put the shaft back in to block big hole ? ive seen where they also just used a 27mm freeze plug to block the hole, so block it or just put the shaft back in
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Old 05-27-2013, 06:36 PM   #13 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
not going to go into a pissing contest, and yes i used the search bar up top and it really doesnt show any mods, atleast not the one's ive just posted
Im sorry you're having issues finding what you're looking for.
Dont "ask jeeves". Your queries should not be in the form of a question.
This ain't jeopardy... None of this: "what mods do I do to my ZX11?" hooplah..
Searching does yield results.. search using keywords, and specifics.
This isnt the first time that a ZX has suffered from the death-tap..
This has all been done before.. there are pics of every mod we've discussed.
No.. no pissing, Charlie Brown..

You already cited one of these links...
There is info regarding someones experience with a modded/new oil relief valve too..
http://www.zl-oa.com/forums/showthre...-oil-flow-mods!
http://www.zx-10r.net/forum/showthre...t=80268&page=3
http://www.zxforums.com/forums/zx-11...ing-fixes.html
http://www.bikeland.org/board/viewth...FID=24&TID=510
http://kawasakiworld.com/racing/4448...alve-mods.html

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
as for my bike to answer you questions,
sending crank to ape,
i am removing the counter balance weight,
even though it only did one bearing in i am replacing all the bearings with black one's can find any color on them so going with the largest,
The counter balance weight?

You have a good bearing, and a good bearing crank journal.. measure them.
Find out what size bushings/bearings you need.
It would be a shame to find out the tolerances are too much after you get the crank back, and order the bushings/bearings.

Confirm you DO NOT have different bushings on 1&4/2&3...

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
doing all of the mods except the mr tubo,
which after looking at these and then seening my motor i can see where the issue was,
plus i am going with the oil relief valve from a 2000 zx11.
And, what was the issue, since you identified it?

Doing all the mods, except the mr. turbo..?
You mean the dry sump oil pan.. ?
The modified oil pan.. ?
The modified oil pick-up tube for the sump..?
Turbo kit?

The relief valve.. is basically the same..
making sure yours is fully functional would be a good place to start.
Before you buy a new one, before you shim it with a washer..

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
my bike does have 40k on it and i ride it like i stole it,
i am not a cruiser, im a ex drag racer and i live in the mountains so the bike gets used,
i ride all year long
So you're a well versed, experienced individual.
GREAT!

I ride hard as well, live in the side of the Sierra Nevada Mtns, and I also ride year around.. or until it snows.

I have nothing to gain by misleading you.
I have a strong affection for these bikes..
I hope you're able to wind another 40k/miles on her!

Quote:
Originally Posted by RickNYzx11 View Post
just used a 27mm freeze plug to block the hole
Freeze plug and a brass plug for the oil galley that feeds the counter balancer.
Dont leave the shaft in there if you're removing the counterbalancer gear ringset on the crank.
kinda defeats the purpose... follow?

INTERMISSION


Quote:
Originally Posted by ninja11zx View Post
as for lurky, more useless post.
You can call me LL, Lou, Louie, Lurky.. whatever your comfortable with..
Learn how to spell, and use punctuation when your trying to call someone out, idiot stick.
...way to prove your superior intelligence, and seniority.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ninja11zx View Post
you post the same thing over and over,
you just trying to get your useless post count up?
Pay attention.. so I dont have to repeat myself..
I know how you hate me repeating myself..
Its not my fcking fault that there is a rash of people on the board at the same time,
having the same issue, and Im offering them sound advice learned from experience.
YOU AIN'T SHOWN ME SH!T, sancho.. and I've been lurking here for years.
Nice try, though..
Quote:
Originally Posted by ninja11zx View Post
only thing you have are rods.
Right.. was that supposed to be a put-down?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ninja11zx View Post
oh,why you telling everyone to get there crank lightened and balanced when yours isn't done?
You're actually RIGHT.. I DONT.

I did the exact same thing that these guys are doing to their bike...
I tore mine into a thousand different pieces, and put it back together...
I purchased NEW fcking RODS, and associated parts.. AND I DIDNT get MY CRANK sorted.

AND, I FCKING REGRET NOT GETTING MINE DONE while I was in there.


So I will keep repeating myself..
Instead of letting someone make the SAME error I did.

So, I HOPE someone learns from MY EXPERIENCE, MY MISTAKE..
Since.. well.. thats what we're all here for anyway.. education in ZX/ZZR.

Except you.. Yor tthe moosst smahartest persun heer.
Fall on a rake, dipswitch.
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Old 05-27-2013, 07:20 PM   #14 (permalink)
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well then, my answer to the OP... when I first got my 11 with a blown motor, rebuilt with a good friends help, and read about all the "oiling issues", I got the Superbike Mike oil bypass done, as well as the extra shim in the pressure relieve valve inside the oil pan. Then I switched engines for one I got with a 1080 Arias Piston Kit, it had an internal bypass done, now there was absolutely nothing wrong with the first motor.. I just like changing things.. LOL.. Now I have the ultimate oil fix.. I switched to the zzr 1200 engine...

I am a firm believer, though, that even with the stock engine, keeping the front tires down, and keeping the oil level up, they will provide you with more miles of pleasurable riding than most individuals will ever take advantage of.... I believe it's all about proper maintenance.

Just my .02

Last edited by hurc; 05-27-2013 at 07:28 PM.
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Old 05-27-2013, 07:31 PM   #15 (permalink)
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This is a snippit from Westech concerning the pros/cons of oil systems modifications..

"This table compares modification options:

Modification
Effective change
Pros
Cons

Oil by-pass system

internal
Increases oil flow to crank assembly
Can overcome build quality restrictions
Costs money.

Oil by-pass system

external
Increases oil flow to crank assembly
Can overcome build quality restrictions
Costs money.

More difficult to install than internal. Oil changes a little messy.

Increase oil pressure
Increases pressure throughout the system
Oil flows more quickly to all orifices, surfaces
More oil pressure costs engine HP. May increase aeration, lessening the films lubricating qualities

Remove balance shaft assembly
Increases initial flow to lower end
If done properly will increase engine response and probably increase oil flow enough to handle most #3 oil flow problems.
If crankshaft isn't very close to target balance values the engine may vibrate itself apart.

Synthetic oil
Cooler running, better lubricating qualities.
Is a good way to add durability to an engine.
If used as a Band-Aid for a compromised oiling system may or may not give enough of a safety margin.

Oil additives
Made to enhance oil qualities
In certain situations can add that little extra protection that is needed.
Generally doesn't do much, if anything to enhance top quality synthetic oil.


If you're on a tight budget and can't afford an oil bypass system you can improve your oiling system a little by carefully honing the 'I' tubes internal fittings. Make sure that after honing you use a round deburring tool to radius the inside joint areas of the tube and fitting. Be careful not to remove too much material or you will have to rebraize the fittings Although this isn't the major restriction in the system, the removal of this material will allow the oil to flow a little move smoothly. This in turn reduces the potential for aeration.

The 'J' tube presents the biggest restriction. At Westech we have a special fitting manufactured and tig welded in a jig to the customer's 'J' tube; the pan is then honed to accept this fitting and we hone/debur the 'I' tube. We offer this modification service for $274.95. Our general turn-around time is 5 days but if you are in dire need we can and will process the pan within 48 hours. "
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Old 05-27-2013, 07:47 PM   #16 (permalink)
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^ was just looking for that..
Couldnt remember where I saw it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by hurc View Post
well then, my answer to the OP... when I first got my 11 with a blown motor, rebuilt with a good friends help, and read about all the "oiling issues", I got the Superbike Mike oil bypass done, as well as the extra shim in the pressure relieve valve inside the oil pan. Then I switched engines for one I got with a 1080 Arias Piston Kit, it had an internal bypass done, now there was absolutely nothing wrong with the first motor.. I just like changing things.. LOL.. Now I have the ultimate oil fix.. [B][I]I switched to the zzr 1200 engine...
ZZR1200 powerplant.. ?
Thats cheatin'

Quote:
Originally Posted by hurc View Post
I am a firm believer, though, that even with the stock engine, keeping the front tires down, and keeping the oil level up, they will provide you with more miles of pleasurable riding than most individuals will ever take advantage of.... I believe it's all about proper maintenance.

Just my .02
Thats worth two bits!

MAINTENANCE

If you bang the hell out of it, shift like gravel, neglect your bike..
Its gonna fail no matter what "mods" you do.
There is no "cure" only preventative measures..
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Old 05-28-2013, 07:42 AM   #17 (permalink)
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actually got to checking bearings with a magnafying glass and found the black mark on them so will be ordering the black bearings, i trimmed the i tube, had the number three bearing didnt line up to the hole so that will be addressed once the crank is checked and done. aligned the hole for the main cap which was off. fully removed the counter balance and actually had a cap to fit it, snugged it in and used loctite

[QUOTE][The relief valve.. is basically the same..
making sure yours is fully functional would be a good place to start.
Before you buy a new one, before you shim it with a washer..

/QUOTE]
they arent the same and thats why they reccomend going to a 98 or newer style one if your bike is older then a 98, they completely changed the style
Pressure was easy, just put a shim in the relief valve and/or use the racing relief valve. The racing relief valve has a piston Vs the earlier relief valves which have a ball. Some later RV's have pistons and I have struggled to tell the difference between their racing RV and some of the stock ones.
I have tried to check them with a fine adjustment pressure regulator with little success. Over time I tried various valves and shim finally settling on the racing version with one 0.060in thick shim. The pn a few years ago was 16130-1057.
this is what i got from a guy that races on the zl forum and for the little cost easier to just get the updated one

hurc i dont do wheelies, i do ride hard, and i do change synthetic oil every 3k on or before, i also do use one additive, and only started using it after several convo's with the company,i do notice a smoother running engine and easier shifts. i sell their products at the dealership i work at, it's called MOA made by bg industies and more then likely will start using thier oil which has this in it already, plus a friend who is a ama racer use's their oil and has been happy with it
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Old 05-28-2013, 10:44 AM   #18 (permalink)
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Quote:
Synthetic oil
Cooler running, better lubricating qualities.
Is a good way to add durability to an engine.
If used as a Band-Aid for a compromised oiling system may or may not give enough of a safety margin.

Oil additives
Made to enhance oil qualities
In certain situations can add that little extra protection that is needed.
Generally doesn't do much, if anything to enhance top quality synthetic oil.
Thanx for that Hurc. Above is my MO. Royal Purple or Spectro Platinum along with a dash of ZDPPlus.....
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Old 05-28-2013, 11:04 AM   #19 (permalink)
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blainethemono View Post
Royal Purple or with a dash of ...
+ 1
Royal purpetrator..
The only oil that is 100 percent miscible with any other lubricant.
I put a single quart of purp' 40w in the mix.. Moly every blue moon.
Fill to top of sight glass... Give a dash of "ooowee"

ZDP Plus..? Is that a terrorist cell?

Last edited by Lurky Louis; 05-28-2013 at 11:06 AM.
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Old 05-28-2013, 12:25 PM   #20 (permalink)
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Quote:
Details

After 70+ years, the EPA mandated that all domestic oil producers remove ZDDP (Zinc Dialkyl Dithio Phosphate) from all conventional and synthetic motor oil. If your engine was designed before 1989 the non-roller lifters require ZDDP to avoid premature deterioration. ZDDP also alters bearing and journal surface characteristics to prevent metal to metal contact. Under extreme conditions like a high performance motor, ZDDP reduces the tendency of parts to scuff or gall under heavy loads. Simply add ZDDP-Plus to every 4-5 quart oil change and your motor will be protected from metal to metal contact. Add one 4 ounce bottle to a 4-5 quart oil change modifier to eliminate and metal-to-metal contact .

"ZDDPlus" is the best insurance to protect your classic or high-performance flat-tappet engine!" says NHRA's #1 Drag Racer of all time, "Big Daddy" Don Garlits.
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