something my buddy did

[Crazyninja]

he put castrol syntec in his bike (zx6r 636). it is oil actually for cars.
it is the energy conserving type. his bike so far after a 300 mile ride has did ok. i don't know what the long term effects are. he says his clutch is not slipping.

[On1Wheel]

I don't think our clutches need special oil. I mean, I know it's a wet clutch but any engine oil is sufficient, right? I hope so because I run a full synthetic for cars.

[Morro Bay Rider]

Originally Posted by On1Wheel

I don't think our clutches need special oil. I mean, I know it's a wet clutch but any engine oil is sufficient, right? I hope so because I run a full synthetic for cars.

wrong wrong wrong.

Q: WILL AUTOMOTIVE OIL HURT MY CLUTCH?

A: Yes. The friction modifiers in motor oil improve fuel economy by making it easier for the gears, bearings, pistons and rings to slip, slide and turn inside the engine. Unfortunately, these friction-minimizing agents also make it easier for the clutch in a motorcycle to slip. If you are using automotive motor oil in your bike, apart from CRFs, you are losing hook-up and acceleration, as well as reducing the life of the clutch.

WILL AUTOMOTIVE MOTOR OIL HURT MY BIKE?

A: It could. If you're using an automotive motor oil in your racing four-stroke, you're not buying the best protection. An API SL oil is missing vital anti-wear components: the most common being zinc, phosphorus and sulfur. These agents are harmful to the catalyst that is used to diminish the level of pollutants in automobile exhaust.

Q: WHY ARE MOTORCYCLE SPECIFIC OILS BETTER?

A: Motorcycle specific oils are pumped up with five times the anti-wear, anti-scuff and extreme pressure additives of regular motor oil. As an added plus, motorcycle oil does not include molybdenum disulfide and other friction modifiers that wreak havoc on clutch performance.

Maxima, a popular motorcycle oil supplier, starts with an API SG Service Category base oil, the last formulation that wasn't regulated as to the amount of zinc-dialkyldithiophosphate (zinc, phosphorus and sulfur) it could contain. Maxima then boosts protection through a proprietary mix of performance additives. The end result is a motorcycle oil that doesn't break down under extreme heat and is tough enough to cushion meshing gears.

[ninja11zx]

Originally Posted by Morro Bay Rider

wrong wrong wrong.

Q: WILL AUTOMOTIVE OIL HURT MY CLUTCH?

A: Yes. The friction modifiers in motor oil improve fuel economy by making it easier for the gears, bearings, pistons and rings to slip, slide and turn inside the engine. Unfortunately, these friction-minimizing agents also make it easier for the clutch in a motorcycle to slip. If you are using automotive motor oil in your bike, apart from CRFs, you are losing hook-up and acceleration, as well as reducing the life of the clutch.

WILL AUTOMOTIVE MOTOR OIL HURT MY BIKE?

A: It could. If you're using an automotive motor oil in your racing four-stroke, you're not buying the best protection. An API SL oil is missing vital anti-wear components: the most common being zinc, phosphorus and sulfur. These agents are harmful to the catalyst that is used to diminish the level of pollutants in automobile exhaust.

Q: WHY ARE MOTORCYCLE SPECIFIC OILS BETTER?

A: Motorcycle specific oils are pumped up with five times the anti-wear, anti-scuff and extreme pressure additives of regular motor oil. As an added plus, motorcycle oil does not include molybdenum disulfide and other friction modifiers that wreak havoc on clutch performance.

Maxima, a popular motorcycle oil supplier, starts with an API SG Service Category base oil, the last formulation that wasn't regulated as to the amount of zinc-dialkyldithiophosphate (zinc, phosphorus and sulfur) it could contain. Maxima then boosts protection through a proprietary mix of performance additives. The end result is a motorcycle oil that doesn't break down under extreme heat and is tough enough to cushion meshing gears.

well you looks like you know alot about oil.personally i think motorcycle specific oils are all b.s. i ave 3 zx11,s and i run mobil 1 car oil in all 3. the one zx is a drag bike that runs 8:80,s @155 on motor and i have never hurt a clutch yet. bike leaves at 7000 rpm with a 1.32 60 ft time. no the clutch is not slipping. oil does its job. i also put this oil in customers bikes and they don't have any issues. maybe the guys that have problems don't know how to launch a bike or the clutch is on the way out already. just my 2cents.

[Hammerhead]

Originally Posted by ninja11zx

well you looks like you know alot about oil.personally i think motorcycle specific oils are all b.s. i ave 3 zx11,s and i run mobil 1 car oil in all 3. the one zx is a drag bike that runs 8:80,s @155 on motor and i have never hurt a clutch yet. bike leaves at 7000 rpm with a 1.32 60 ft time. no the clutch is not slipping. oil does its job. i also put this oil in customers bikes and they don't have any issues. maybe the guys that have problems don't know how to launch a bike or the clutch is on the way out already. just my 2cents.

You are fortunate most synthetic car oils do not contain the mileage-enhancing friction modifiers that cause wet clutches to slip. Motorcycle-specific oils contain anti-shear additives that prevent viscosity breakdown caused by transmission gears meshing. Even a blind squirrel gets a nut now and then.

[Amsoil Dealer Group]

Originally Posted by ninja11zx

well you looks like you know alot about oil.personally i think motorcycle specific oils are all b.s. i ave 3 zx11,s and i run mobil 1 car oil in all 3. the one zx is a drag bike that runs 8:80,s @155 on motor and i have never hurt a clutch yet. bike leaves at 7000 rpm with a 1.32 60 ft time. no the clutch is not slipping. oil does its job. i also put this oil in customers bikes and they don't have any issues. maybe the guys that have problems don't know how to launch a bike or the clutch is on the way out already. just my 2cents.

First off, you don't say which Mobil 1 you are running. Mobil 1 is a company, not a product and they produce petroleum, hydro-cracked and some PAO Products although the Mobil 1 EP is now coming back from analysis as a Hydr-Cracked Product.

As far as a I know, Mobil 1 Racing 4T and their V-Twin oils are still PAO Based ...

Most manuals will say that an Automotive oil can be used as long as it has one of two requirements, It must carry a API SG/SH Rating and/or JASO MA Rating.

An SM, SL or other, Does Not Automatically Supercede the SG/SH Rating. They can carry both, but it must be listed on the label.

There is definitely something to Mobil 1 Auto oil when used in a bike and it is a case by case basis. Some slip, some chatter and this may happen over time as the oils are not made to clean off from the wet clutch and will get a varnish buildup. This has also been noted when switched away from M-1 to other oils and the next oil was blamed.

Originally Posted by Hammerhead

You are fortunate most synthetic car oils do not contain the mileage-enhancing friction modifiers that cause wet clutches to slip. Motorcycle-specific oils contain anti-shear additives that prevent viscosity breakdown caused by transmission gears meshing. Even a blind squirrel gets a nut now and then.

All oils have some type of Friction Modifiers, just some are not as detrimental to the clutch, which I think you are saying. With an SM oil, I don't think there is one oil out there that will carry the SG/SH Rating or JASO MA Spec.

You are correct about the shearing characteristics of the oils. Add a little soap to your oil and you almost have a grease making machine.

Some oils may use polymers as a Viscosity Improver and your transmission is quite a bit like a Centrifuge that may seperate some polymers out of the oil and can cause shifting problems.

Take a look at the G-2156 Link in our Sig. Some oils do better than others for storage with higher TBN and anti-rust and corrosion inhibitors, shear, foaming and wear than others.

Pick one of the Top 3 Finishers in the proper viscosity range and you will have a good oil.

Bob

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[ninja11zx]

Well Bob , i also like ams oil. i do run the motorcycle stuff and the bike will pick up a couple tenth's over the mobil. i'm sold on both brands.

[Amsoil Dealer Group]

Originally Posted by ninja11zx

Well Bob , i also like ams oil. i do run the motorcycle stuff and the bike will pick up a couple tenth's over the mobil. i'm sold on both brands.

You won't go wrong with either one. Just stay with the M/C Specific..

.

[zaneyzrex]

long as its NOT energy conserving u should be ok.

crazy i think ur buddy is messin with ya or miss read the bottle

[Amsoil Dealer Group]

Originally Posted by zaneyzrex

long as its NOT energy conserving u should be ok.

crazy i think ur buddy is messin with ya or miss read the bottle

Actually, it goes beyond that...

Look for the API Rating(s) od SG/SH and/or the JASO Rating of MA or MA 2

Sj,Sl or SM DO NOT automatically Supercede SG/SH

Bob

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[zaneyzrex]

Originally Posted by Amsoil Dealer Group

Actually, it goes beyond that...

Look for the API Rating(s) od SG/SH and/or the JASO Rating of MA or MA 2

Sj,Sl or SM DO NOT automatically Supercede SG/SH

Bob

.

not diagreeing but if you need some in a hurry then ya only need to worry about NO ENERGY CONSERVING

[Amsoil Dealer Group]

Originally Posted by zaneyzrex

not diagreeing but if you need some in a hurry then ya only need to worry about NO ENERGY CONSERVING

There is way too much information and much of it from the internet and mechanics or parts people that do not study oil. This has been my business for over 25 yrs now.

It needs to have an SG/SH Rating to qualify for use in a Motorcycle if you have a Wet Clutch.

That Energy Donut does not cover some of the new Friction Modifiers on the market.. That is like all the stuff started about Moly, most of which is BULLoney.

Bob

[Crazyninja]

The crazy thing is that the average consumer does not have the "laboratory" to test and if you test on your own "investment" (your bike) and it goes wrong, its going to cost you a lot of money for your "lab results".

[Amsoil Dealer Group]

Originally Posted by Crazyninja

The crazy thing is that the average consumer does not have the "laboratory" to test and if you test on your own "investment" (your bike) and it goes wrong, its going to cost you a lot of money for your "lab results".

That is why you look at our Motorcycle Oil Tests which are done by Several of the Top Testing Facilities in the US.

Also why you DO NOT listen to Joe Biker about using this or that oil.. He doesn't have to pay for your repairs.

Bob

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