Dirty Oil-Opinions needed

[07zx6Guy]

I have a 07 zx6r. Im usally do my oil changes around 800-1000 miles. Not paying attention, i have put about 1600 miles on this oil. I run the repsol moto 4t oil. The oil is very dirty. I would like to ensure when i do my oil change, that all the dirty oil is gone. Is it ok to run straight 30w oil to run through the motor before adding the new repsol oil? Any suggestions would be great.


Thanks

[bluedevil10r]

I think your being too anal.

[Morgan]

Are you riding your bike through Sahara Desert dust storms or something? Dude, you're wasting oil, money, and the environment. Oil won't stay clear, but will not be "dirty" by any means, and will have lubricating properties. Really. 3000 miles is way too early too, but some people like to be extra cautious. Go to google and search on "motor oil analysis". Get the kit. Send in a sample. Read the results. You'll be stunned at how much life the oil you're throwing away has.

To answer your question, sure you can run in a batch of oil to dilute the little bit of dirty oil that stays in the bike and drain that out before filling up with other oil. Won't hurt a thing other than your pocket book and the environment. Your oil company and retailers both thank you.

Oh..... if you ignore my advice, can you tell me what oil you buy so I can go buy stock? LOL ;) Just teasing you a little.

[Hammerhead]

The only way I'd ever change oil at 1000 miles would be if that's all the miles I rode in a year.

[07zx6Guy]

I just assumed that when the oil got dirty you changed it. This is my first bike, and i would rather be educated on what to do, than be ignorant and not do anything. Thanks for the tips. AT what interval do suggest changing the oil? I do ride alot. I got the bike in november with zero miles and have 5600 on it now.

thanks

[asecretninja]

Oh lord here we go. Don't ever ask opinions on oil change frequencies. You'll get nothing but opinions. If you want to do it every 1000 miles, you go right ahead. Your bike will thank you. I personally do mine every 2000, because that is what I was recommended by someone who's opinion I trust.

Do you ride your bike really hard? Do you shift hard/fast often at high RPMs? Basically the harder you ride your bike, the more frequently you should change your oil.

I worked in an auto-shop in highschool, and I have seen some fucking DIRTY oil. If your oil is BLACK, then there might be a problem. But if its that usual brownish color, then you shouldn't be worried. Some blow hard a few posts earlier stated that your oil will still lubricate your engine at 2k, 3k, even 4k miles.. but that's not what oil changing is about. Hell synthetic oil is good for 10-12k miles on cars, but you have to remember that there are a ton of moving parts inside of your crank case. The reason that your oil is dark is because of the dirt and particles suspended in the oil, not because it's not lubricating anymore. A lot of people aren't able to separate the two from each other. Sure it still lubricates at 3k miles, but you will have 3x as much gunk and shit floating around in your oil than you would had you changed your oil at 1k miles like you do. And changing your oil often doesn't hurt the environment unless you're an idiot and don't properly dispose of your oil. That's the worst excuse for NOT changing your oil I have ever heard. I think it came from the same blowhard who was pitching spectral analysis.

Too long didn't read version: You are hurting nothing by changing your oil frequently. Don't let people scare you into changing it less often. Just do what feels right to you. You will get a zillion different opinions on how often to change your oil, so just stick with what feels right. If you ride your bike moderately hard, change it more often. If you just like to cruise (can you cruise on a 250?) then you could get away with changing it less often. I'm perfectly happy with every 2k miles.

I just saw that you're on a 600, not a 250. I'll concede that 1k miles is probably too early. You could go as long as 3, but again are you revving the fuck out of the thing all the time? If so, I'd change it more around the 2-2.5k mile mark.

[Shifty1]

If you bought the bike new, it came with an owner's manual that has a "Periodic Maintenance Chart". For the most part, I follow those intervals. I do change my oil a little more often but for everything else, I stick to the manufacturers recommendations. Every 1000 miles is overkill but if it makes you feel better, go for it. I would relax on it a bit and change it every 2500-3000 miles. Even at 3000 miles, you'll still be changing the oil twice as often as the manual recommends.

[Kaz]

i usually run around 5k or so before changing mine. Doesnt matter what vehicle it is.

[rexmitchell]

Amsoil offers oil analysis kits that can tell you how well your oil is performing and what your engine is doing.

[villian88]

I dont know about in bikes (Because the composition of the oil is different, which is why you should ONLY use motorcycle specific oil in motorcycles) but in cars the oils contain many additives, which don't really begin to work untill after a thousand or so miles...which is why you do NOT want to change your oil too often (aka every 1000 miles) in a car. By doing so you are not allowing the additional wear protectors and detergents to set in, and are actually causing more wear inside the engine. Basically fresh oil, and super old oil, cause wear. You want something in-between, usually 1.5-4k in a car is that sweet spot for when the oil works best.

[bluedevil10r]

Originally Posted by asecretninja

Oh lord here we go. Don't ever ask opinions on oil change frequencies. You'll get nothing but opinions. If you want to do it every 1000 miles, you go right ahead. Your bike will thank you. I personally do mine every 2000, because that is what I was recommended by someone who's opinion I trust.

Do you ride your bike really hard? Do you shift hard/fast often at high RPMs? Basically the harder you ride your bike, the more frequently you should change your oil.

I worked in an auto-shop in highschool, and I have seen some fucking DIRTY oil. If your oil is BLACK, then there might be a problem. But if its that usual brownish color, then you shouldn't be worried. Some blow hard a few posts earlier stated that your oil will still lubricate your engine at 2k, 3k, even 4k miles.. but that's not what oil changing is about. Hell synthetic oil is good for 10-12k miles on cars, but you have to remember that there are a ton of moving parts inside of your crank case. The reason that your oil is dark is because of the dirt and particles suspended in the oil, not because it's not lubricating anymore. A lot of people aren't able to separate the two from each other. Sure it still lubricates at 3k miles, but you will have 3x as much gunk and shit floating around in your oil than you would had you changed your oil at 1k miles like you do. And changing your oil often doesn't hurt the environment unless you're an idiot and don't properly dispose of your oil. That's the worst excuse for NOT changing your oil I have ever heard. I think it came from the same blowhard who was pitching spectral analysis.

Too long didn't read version: You are hurting nothing by changing your oil frequently. Don't let people scare you into changing it less often. Just do what feels right to you. You will get a zillion different opinions on how often to change your oil, so just stick with what feels right. If you ride your bike moderately hard, change it more often. If you just like to cruise (can you cruise on a 250?) then you could get away with changing it less often. I'm perfectly happy with every 2k miles.

I just saw that you're on a 600, not a 250. I'll concede that 1k miles is probably too early. You could go as long as 3, but again are you revving the fuck out of the thing all the time? If so, I'd change it more around the 2-2.5k mile mark.

Go back to school....

[bluedevil10r]

Originally Posted by villian88

I dont know about in bikes (Because the composition of the oil is different, which is why you should ONLY use motorcycle specific oil in motorcycles) but in cars the oils contain many additives, which don't really begin to work untill after a thousand or so miles...which is why you do NOT want to change your oil too often (aka every 1000 miles) in a car. By doing so you are not allowing the additional wear protectors and detergents to set in, and are actually causing more wear inside the engine. Basically fresh oil, and super old oil, cause wear. You want something in-between, usually 1.5-4k in a car is that sweet spot for when the oil works best.

Do what?!!!

[bluedevil10r]

Originally Posted by rexmitchell

Amsoil offers oil analysis kits that can tell you how well your oil is performing and what your engine is doing.

So does Autozone.....

[arcticsun]

I've thrown everything I've learned about lubrication and engines out the window. They take alot of abuse. If a motor self destructs, its rarely an oils fault. Its a design/engineering issue form the beginning, and oil makes worse.

So do one oil change send a sample in, get a TBN analysis to tell you how much more life the oil has left, and use the same oil and stick to the same interval.

At one auto company we run 7500 mi intervals, I work at a proving grounds, and my current test vehicle has put on roughly 30000 miles on the same oil filter with 7500 mi oil change intervals...WOTing, downshifting, and driving through the desert. Runs like a top. I'll let you know how the tear down goes in two weeks.

Granted motorcycle engines are rather precise, but it should be engineered quite well.

[villian88]

Originally Posted by bluedevil10r

Do what?!!!

The additives (Detergents/cleaners) in regular auto oil take a few miles to start setting in, therefore having too frequent of oil changes basically negates any positive effect they have, taking your oil back to a 1950's type non-detergent rating, and causing more engine wear (by changing the oil far too frequently)

[JKL1960]

This seems appropriate to this thread.

May be NSFW.

[bluedevil10r]

Originally Posted by villian88

The additives (Detergents/cleaners) in regular auto oil take a few miles to start setting in, therefore having too frequent of oil changes basically negates any positive effect they have, taking your oil back to a 1950's type non-detergent rating, and causing more engine wear (by changing the oil far too frequently)

Wow so in all my years in racing I've changed my oil too much, holey crap! Thank god I've never blown an engine. Yes I'm being sarcastic...

[villian88]

Originally Posted by bluedevil10r

Wow so in all my years in racing I've changed my oil too much, holey crap! Thank god I've never blown an engine. Yes I'm being sarcastic...

Obviously I'm not talking about "racing". If I were I would have said something to the effect of "change your oil after every run, or every 1/4 mile, or 200 miles"...based on what type of racing you're talking about, rather than discussing the merits of allowing detergents and cleaners to set in after the initial 1,000 mile mark on a new oil change. Get a clue.

[Morgan]

Sweet jesus... Racing isn't exactly normal use.

I get a kick out of asecretninja's post... he basically tells you that opinions are worthless, then tells you to follow his opinion which is based on the opinion of someone he trusts.

As I said, don't listen to ANYONE'S OPINION. Have your oil analyzed scientifically and learn for yourself. What I GUARANTEE you will learn is that if you're a street rider, you're wasting your money and oil life if you change your oil ever 3000 miles, in MOST likelihood. In Melbourne Florida you won't have much of a down season, if at all. You probably won't ever go more than a week or two without being able to ride at all. If you live somewhere that you do get a down season, it's best to change your oil BEFORE storage, not after.

But don't listen to me. SUre sure, I've been riding for over 20 years, and I've had a bunch of bikes.. but my experiences are anecdotal. Just have your oil analyzed.

If you're hell bent on changing oil ever 3000 miles, use a high quality mineral oil to save a little money. If you want to save the most money, and not change your damn oil all that often, use a high quality synthetic, and have it analyzed to figure out what the interval should be.

[villian88]

Originally Posted by Morgan

Sweet jesus... Racing isn't exactly normal use.

.......If you're hell bent on changing oil ever 3000 miles, use a high quality mineral oil to save a little money. If you want to save the most money, and not change your damn oil all that often, use a high quality synthetic, and have it analyzed to figure out what the interval should be.

You have completed managed to mis-read my post. I was pointing to that exact thing...racing isnt normal use...and the ONLY reason you should change your oil every 1k miles, or hell..after every run...is if you race.

Normal oil lasts much longer than 3k miles, that's my point, and that's your point. Agreed? In addition to that I was stating that changing oil too often can cause more bad than good, due to the wear detergents not taking effect untill after 1k miles on a fresh oil change. Point is, oil analysis or not, go longer than 3k miles...as ANY synthetic oil can easily handle 4 or 5 thousand miles...in a bike...and way more in a car.

Geezus...I feel like you're repeating my exact points.